Tuesday, December 28, 2021

Diving deep into Jesus and Mary Magdalene might be hazardous to Christianity :-)

I reposted yesterday's Were Jesus and Mary Magdalene a couple who had a child? into a very large online spirituality forum and got quite a few replies. Three discussion threads went kinda deep.

Thread 1:

I don't think we will ever know the answer to this. And I don't think the answer really matters. If there are descendants of Jesus Christ and Mary Magdalene out there, would they be any more holy than anyone else?
Have you read the Gospel of Mary? It seems to me like it was written very shortly after the death of Jesus, and all of his friends gathered together to speak about the things he told each of them in private. Mary Magdalene, being the only woman in the group, spoke about the things Jesus said to her, but she was ridiculed.

Chapter 9

1)When Mary had said this, she fell silent, since it was to this point that the Savior had spoken with her.

2) But Andrew answered and said to the brethren, Say what you wish to say about what she has said. I at least do not believe that the Savior said this. For certainly these teachings are strange ideas.

3) Peter answered and spoke concerning these same things.

4) He questioned them about the Savior: Did He really speak privately with a woman and not openly to us? Are we to turn about and all listen to her? Did He prefer her to us?

5) Then Mary wept and said to Peter, My brother Peter, what do you think? Do you think that I have thought this up myself in my heart, or that I am lying about the Savior?

6) Levi answered and said to Peter, Peter you have always been hot tempered.

7) Now I see you contending against the woman like the adversaries.

8) But if the Savior made her worthy, who are you indeed to reject her? Surely the Savior knows her very well.

9) That is why He loved her more than us. Rather let us be ashamed and put on the perfect Man, and separate as He commanded us and preach the gospel, not laying down any other rule or other law beyond what the Savior said.

10) And when they heard this they began to go forth to proclaim and to preach. 

It seems to me like they were extremely jealous that Jesus told such important and advanced teachings to a woman but yet not to them. I wonder if they would have been so jealous if she was his wife. Although, I'm sure it was still not commonplace for the time period for a man to want his wife to be as smart or smarter than himself, so they would probably still be shocked to find out he told her such things. However, Andrew refers to her as just a woman, instead of as Jesus' wife. I think they would at least have the dignity to respect their "Saviors" wife, if that were the case. But again, perhaps they wouldn't, because things were very different back then.
If you really hear his teachings, Jesus did not love any one person more than any other. Be it Mary Magdalene or anyone else. I doubt that marriage/having children would have been a priority of his. If I had to guess, I would say Jesus did not appear to Mary at the tomb because she was special to him. He most likely did it to teach the disciples the importance of equality, that women are just as able to receive revelation as men are, and that they shouldn't place themselves above/below anyone else.

People carrying that blood are different ... What they do with that is another matter ...
Weren't the male disciples off in hiding when the three women went to the tomb and encountered Jesus? Why didn't Jesus send his mother or the other woman to the disciples? Why did he send the woman some of them had great difficulty with? Hmmm.
I have not read the Gospel of Mary, but would be interested in what she said that Jesus had told her, which did not go down well with some of the men present.
I was told Magdalene scribed the Letter to the Hebrews in the New Testament, anonymously, as no man would have read it if a woman was known to be the author.
That book is not featured much in Christian churches. It is addressed to Jews who had known Jesus and were falling back into their old habits. The scribe tells them they should be teaching, they should be eating meat, but they are drinking milk. The scribe warns then of the peril of turning away from the cleansing of the Lord. The scribe tells them that Jesus is high priest in Melchizedek.
I think it was in 1991, this came to be very slowly from very far a way, after my wife at that time asked I knew anything about Melchizedek, and I said there was an eternal being in human form who had dealings with Abraham in Genesis:


Melchizedek is an order of angel that comes to a planet in trouble ...

Melchizedek comes to prepare the planet to receive the Christ ...

Christ does not come to a planet without Melchizedek ...

Mary Magdalene was of the Order Melchizedek ... 

Why did he send Mary? Well if she understood his message the best... what better messenger is there than her? :)
You should read Mary’s gospel, it is very very short because a majority of it is missing, including whatever Jesus told her there. Unfortunately I doubt that is a coincidence.
That is very beautiful what you wrote about Melchizedek. It is my personal belief that all human souls can be traced to higher beings. Because the further up in dimension you go, the more unified everything is, so everything merges and there are less beings. But here in the third dimension there are billions and trillions of them. In the highest dimension everything is one.
For example my soul is a small fractal of the Archangel Metatron. I feel insane saying this but I’ve received about a dozen synchronicities confirming it so I’m pretty confident in saying it at this point. And there are plenty of other Metatron fractals living on Earth now. So if what you wrote here is true, perhaps Jesus and Mary are soul fractals of the being Melchizedek.
This is where I think uk‘s idea of twin flames comes in. I don’t usually like to use that term because so many people are misguided about it and use it to describe their toxic on/off relationships. But I’m not really sure of a better word to use. Jesus and Mary come from the same soul group. If they were lovers at all, it was a love that transcended the traditional idea of marriage and “special” love. It’s very hard to describe this if you have not read “A Course in Miracles.” Which, if you are that interested in Jesus, I highly recommend you do.

I don't think you are insane.
A pity the heart of Magdalene's Gospel is "missing". Yeah, right :-). I was told Magdalene, Jesus and Judas were a team, a triad. They were the awake ones in Jesus' entourage. Privately they discussed things, coming attractions, planned skits for the benefit of the others close by - the disciples. Judas was the only person Jesus trusted to play the role of the betrayer. Judas didn't want to do it, but it was his role to play. He was so upset, he killed himself. Had Judas not done that, as a minister once told me, God would have done great things with Judas. As I told the minister, then, we might not have ever heard of St. Paul. The minister took a breath. Magdalene and Jesus were a couple in all ways, it was part of their respective and joint soul alchemy.
I read A COURSE IN MIRACLES in 1988. Doing the 365 day Course is something else entirely. I did not do it, but I understood it. We don't know what anything that happens is about, so don't t fry to figure anything out. Just do the daily exercise and try not to react to anything that punches your buttons and simply sit in the burn doing nothing causes. Do that 365 days and you are a different person. I was being taken through a course in mirrors, which was heaps of fun. Taken by angels. I have a friend who has had a number of experiences with Metatron. Mine have been with Jesus, Michael, Melchizedek, Rosa Mystica and Kali over India way. They left me convinced I was Judas at one time.

Thread 2:

a (perhaps annoying) question for you:
why does it matter?

Not at all annoying, yours is a good question.
Just as a person has a subconscious, which is far greater than the person's conscious mind/thinking, so do groups of people, such as ... religions .. have a subconscious. If something in the conscious is not accurate, it causes disturbance in the subconscious, which in turn affects the conscious of a person or persons, groups, say ... religions.
A devout Christian, who is not a fanatic, wrote to me today about this topic, "I think that Jesus had a more important mission than being married and having children."
I wonder how Jesus could relate well to mothers and fathers, if he was not himself one? Don't we have thousands of Catholic priests, who say they are celibate, giving marriage and parenting advice to mothers and fathers about this or that issue the priests have no clue of what it's like, not having been a mother or a father?
What the notion that Jesus was a celibate monk has done is throw a very large wrinkle, rhymes with DISTURBANCE, into the collective subconscious, rhymes with FORCE, of Christendom, and into every person in Christendom who still views Jesus as a celibate monk. It has DISTURBED the natural masculine-feminine, yin-yang balance in that that religion and its adherents. As has ignoring that Jesus and Mary Magdalene were a couple, a role model for heterosexual men and women.

interesting reply, thanks. I wonder what you think of the fact that buddha had a wife & kids (although he walked out on them for quite a while!) yet buddhist monks also adhere to celibacy?

My recollection is the Eastern Catholic church separated from the western Catholic church over whether priests should be celibate. In the Eastern church, priests can marry.
Buddha was a monk when he is said to have reached enlightenment. Perhaps that is why Buddhist monks are celibate?
I read somewhere some years ago that Buddha insisted he was not a god but merely was a man, and a teacher greater than himself would come. Was that greater teacher Jesus in the Gospels?
There is a path that involves celibacy, and yet the Dalai Lama, who is of the Tibetan strain of Buddhism, has come back a few or more times, and he has declared he will not be coming back as a Tibetan the next time around. So, does celibacy get one off the karmic wheel?
I wonder about celibate priests and nuns, are they such because they are called into that path, or because they are fleeing from what actually is their path? To be fully in this world, and to progress to being fully in it, but not of it?
I was put with a number of remarkable women, not all at once, and each of them were used to open or wake up something sleeping in me.

Thread 3:

Literally watch, listen and then Google a breakdown of The Da Vinci Code. It's one of those movies that takes a few watchings to truly grasp and it is a bit sensationalised because it is a movie after all but it does a good job explaining it if you ignore the drama of the characters and listen to the lore.
But you generally covered it in your post already. Holy grail is not a cup but a reference to a divine bloodline.

I saw the movie years ago. I already was aware of the child, and of the Grail, as a state of being, which can be achieved, but it's steep going. The main characters in the movie modeled some of how seeking the Grail state of being goes.
In the Gospels, Jesus said his baptism was in fire and spirit, and John the Baptist had prophesied that would be the way of the one who was to come, whose sandals he was not worthy to latch.
Based on my personal experiences, the Grail approach and Jesus's baptism are very similar, if not the same thing.
The bloodline of Jesus and Mary does exist, it has spread all around the world, and people who have it in their veins know they are different, like they feel they are not from this planet, even though they certainly are here and have to deal with what all life here serves up, which, I suppose, is a version of the Grail journey, Jesus's baptism.
Both entail living in and enduring this world and its ways and responding in road less traveled, off beaten path, out of the box ways, which includes taking risks, trusting the process, getting roughed up, having glorious moments - in, but not of, this world - well, that's my take after living it since early 1987, when it began with an other world intervention. I'm now in my 80th year.

Better yet, read the book that it ripped off: Holy Blood, Holy Grail.
Or not. It's an interesting intellectual exercise, but not that useful now.
The bible also credits Jesus with telling his apostles, "Greater works than these shall you do!" Wut mean? Miracles? Raising ten dead people at a time? Creating an army to subjugate the rest of the known world? Curious twists in the truth are taken when large groups of human beings start writing down history.

I described HOLY BLOOD, HOLY GRAIL in the post above these reader comments.
In the Gospels, Jesus also tells his disciples that he taught the masses in parables but he taught them the mysteries of the Kingdom of God in secret, and wise men and kings would give all they possessed to have those secrets. So, what did Jesus teach them in secret?
Jesus also told the disciples that he had other flocks they did not know about. So, where were those other flocks?

You'll enjoy this. Someone interpreted the Book of Revelations a tiny bit differently than its common interpretation.
The seven seals are the seven chakras in the human body. Unlocking these seals reveals you true identity, which shatters the illusions created by religions to hold things together. No horsemen need apply.
This is more in tune with the definition of the Greek apok├ílypsis “uncovering".
What's the correct interpretation? I don't care; I don't have a dog in that fight. I like the Greek one because it fits how I see healing working; taking the layers of silt off of our awareness.

Yes, I do like that interpretation, but it does leave out a bit of that very wild vision, or whatever it was happened to John. The angels on my case told me John did not understand Revelation back then, so how could someone today who did not experience it? That's all the schooling the angels gave me about Revelation. I had a lady friend who had a number of dreams about the 4 horsemen in Revelation, but those dreams seemed to have to do with her own personal journey and not the takes many Christian ministers and lay people try to make of Revelation. In 1999, I met a Christian minister, who'd gone into and endured and emerged very different person from a dark night, who agreed with me that the Bible is an internal teaching and to view it as an external teaching is to miss the point.

I think John didn't measure his shrooms accurately!

After what all I've been through and experienced without even one shroom or anything similar, I don't go there when I hear or read of someone having direct experiences with other realms. In fact, that's what I look for, because direct experiences are entirely different from reading or being told about such.

+10 for direct experiences!
Which leads me back to an earlier thing I said; it's not that useful to dwell on bible stories. At least, not for me. There are easier paths to the same truths without wading through the mud of the religions surrounding the bible stories. Not saying there are short cuts. Just saying that lots of folks have spent their lives studying the various texts; I'm more of a tactile learner.
That's why studying healing worked so well for me. I could use my hands. I could feel the energy change. I could hear the feedback from the healee.
That practice made for an extended ride on the fun boat!

I had extensive existential training in healing work, starting in massage school and expanding from there. I met a lot of gifted healers, and while they helped me some, there was much more they could not get at, and some told me that and some did not. I spent a lot of money before I figured out I needed to go another route, and I treated quite a few people myself, including a few mental health workers with lettered credentials. Stuff came up out of me and people in same training and later when I was trying to be a healer, which was hugely volatile and distressing. It was not fun.
However, after angels took me over in early 1987, I began weaning from that work. I taught a few people what I was being taught, which people could use for themselves. Then, it went to where it was just trying to keep up and stay in sync with the angels, as life threw one test at me after another. That became the program. The grist of this world and how I responded to it in keeping with my training and ongoing guidance was, and is, the alchemy machine.
Most Americans I met along that way were raised in Christendom, a few were raised in Judaism, and one was a white aborigine with no religious history. She had gone toward the New Age, as had I for a while, and many others. Others had gone toward Native American spirituality, others toward Sufism, others toward Buddhism, others toward Eastern gurus, others toward Taoism, others toward Occult methods, others toward shamanism. I was made a shaman, then I was made something more.
The titles perhaps are distracting. But what I saw in all of the travelers but the white aborigine was they had left a spiritual system for a spiritual system they patched on top of it, but the original spiritual system was still working very hard in them. When I told a woman, who had found yet another guru that she was still looking for the Jesus that had not worked for her in her childhood, she laughed, said I was spot on.
 By then, the angels had taken me back into Christendom and through it into something else, which, as I mentioned, did not seem to appeal to Christians I told about it, even though I was naming angels in the Bible.

Christians don't care much for what I have to say, and I don't spend much time talking with them about God, which is what I was raised to call what started everything and still is around. I was drenched in politics for many years and did almost no spiritual healing work. What a cesspool - politics. Of late, I have drifted back toward this sort of discussion. It's the area where I was trained very hard for many years, first by people, then by angels, whose perspectives and approaches are very, very different from what I learned from people, yet the people were essential parts of where I had come from and was going. Even now.

What an amazing path you've traveled!
LOL I've had people in my early life tell me I'd make a great US Senator. I told them I couldn't lie that well! They said this because they had seen me arbitrate heated verbal fights and some physical fights with no previous training, just my innate sense of what needed to be done to resolve things. I didn't know anything about the senate, except that everyone there was a politician and I'm not.
I'm no longer a Christian, even though I'm an ordained minister in a Christian church and on good personal terms with Jesus. It's probably my dislike of politics again. Growing into leadership positions in a dynamic group can cause changes that I'm unwilling to make this lifetime.
LOL nobody cares much for what you and I have to say! I mean, we aren't preaching to a choir in the bigger scheme of things. We're guiding the few and far between that seek us out and cross our paths. It's made for a lovely life in my case.
This sub and my choice to participate on it is a new experience for me. I'm a clairvoyant and enjoy reading, but never thought I'd do it through a text messaging system. It works better than I thought it would, which is wonderful. I find it one of the best benefits that the pandemic has provided me.

Heh, for many years now, I very seldom have someone ask me for spiritual advice. Although I once trained in and did some mediation, I'm not usually a bringer together. I have no following. I'm nearly always a minority report, and I'm nearly always ignored, and often am told I'm crazy, or worse. That has happened a number of times at this spirituality forum, although not in the discussion under this Jesus-Mary Magdalene post. This forum's moderation panel has taken down some of my posts. All of my posts are probes, and what comes back is information, and all of it, me included, is weighed by a moderation board that is not of this world.


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