A smorgasbord from an online spirituality forum in which I participate:
If there were no Devil, could humanity spiritually evolve?
B
God is real don’t be an asshole. If you encounter evil act to rid your world of it.
my thoughts on the matter.
At first your post title made me think you were saying evil is necessary to advance us spiritually… but ask yourself what the worst evil you can think of is… then ask yourself why it is necessary.
I feel earth is a sorting table for souls, fuck knows why people would damn themselves outside of delusion aka illusions of satanic origin.
I found your thing on lower frequencies harboring evil interesting, plains of existence as it were.
Me
Actually, I know God exists, have been conscripted and turned upside down and inside out and every which a way but loose by angels who call themselves Jesus, Michael, Melchizedek, Rosa Mystica. I've been having conversations with people who deny the Devil exists and/or have their own spin on the Devil, which works for them, but does not match my experience with the Devil or that realm. So, I posed very sincerely the question, If there were no Devil, could humanity spiritually evolve? For isn't that why souls incarnate on this world, to spiritually evolve? Or not? And don't souls need something here that opposes them, challenges them, even threatens them, so that they can evolve? Or not? But then, in the Old Testament is, Fear of the Lord is the beginning of Wisdom. And wisdom is assigned the female gender :-)
I
to spiritually evolve?
This may happen as a result but does not have to be the reason, there does not need to be a reason for every thing. Reason is a very human notion.
The idea that we all have souls is another meta narrative and may or may not be true but asserts itself as if it can explain everything
Me
Jesus in the Gospels was a meta narrative when he spoke of souls? And, when he spoke of the Devil?
I
Christianity is a meta narrative.
The idea of the existence of souls is a meta narrative.
The idea or belief in a devil is a meta narrative.
Meta narratives are inescapable and meta narrative itself is a meta narrative.
But the idea of a soul existing beyond the body or beyond physical form is a meta narrative that many people utilize to create some pseudo sense of true morality. "If I do good, whatever that is, my soul will be rewarded. If I do bad, my soul will be punished." The idea of a soul is a way to spiritually bypass death.
The devil attempts to explain all evil or bad things or provides a scapegoat for our own spiritual deformities and delusions.
Christianity could not exist without the devil. Christians believe in satan way more than they believe in god.
Me
Christianity could not exist without God, nothing could exist without God, which I was raised to call the Source.
I have been head to head with the Devil and Demons, up close and personal, and with people being influenced by same. I am doing that just about every day. Those people do not know what's influencing them and would not believe me, or would be offended with me, if I told them. They might even say I'm crazy, or it's me the Devil is influencing.
I can imagine this spirituality group itself is meta-thinking, talking.
However, once I experienced a 4-year dark night of the soul, which was forecasted in a dream, and soon it came. It finally lifted after I had 3 visions in five days' time, which left my heart heaving and rivers of tears gushing out of my eyes and snot out of my nose.
About two years later, a black night of the soul descended, which made the dark night seem like a picnic. During it, I had only three dreams, when I had been having several dreams a night before it arrived. The three dreams showed me I was not totally abandoned by God. A good friend, who had had dreams about me for several years, had a few dreams when I was in the black night, that showed I was in better shape than I thought.
I kept getting nudges to leave that woman I was with, but I was too screwed up to do it. Finally, I knew I had to leave her, regardless. After I left, the black night began to lift. I started dreaming again, and the dreams were informative for me.
I went through a long stretch of various kind of healings provided by angels, including being told in my sleep one night that my soul would be reattached to me, and the next night there was a lot of strange stuff in my dreams and in me, which I felt energetically.
After that, the angels did other things in me, as my external life now was much different, and every day new tests came, and every day even now new tests come.
I deal with Evil every day, and am ever on guard trying to not let Evil resident in me to screw up what I am provided to experience. I get plenty of advice, correction and even spanking in dreams and energetically, when I screw up something, and I get psychically attacked a lot, and I absorb the garbage and evil in what I engage on this world and process it through and out of me with those angels' help.
So, what I described above is META, as in PHYSICS. Jesus in the Gospels, was METAPHYSICS squared and cubed. This forum is mostly a wading pool.
B
Careful of who you think are angels. They do t speak directly to us.
Me
"do t"? Did you mean, "don't?" If so, where or how did you come up with that?
B
Hey thanks for the auto correct. Congrats on your life’s work.
God forbid you address the point I made, so much easier to throw a grammar tantrum
P
The if so sentence isn’t about correcting you, he’s saying if so you said don’t, … he just was checking you meant don’t
B
Thank you, yes I meant don’t.
Me
And, if B meant don't, where or now did he come with angels don't speak directly to us? They speak directly to me and to a very good friend of mine. They have spoken directly to other people I have known well. In plain English they spoke. In other ways, they speak to me ongoing, but it's a code of sorts they have worked me into being able to cypher, and that sometimes requires further coded messages until I get the point. That's been going on nearly 40 years for me.
L
Devil is our shadow
Me
and God's shadow
L
Well that's a given. God is omniscient, Satan is fixed.
Me
Compared to God, everything is fixed? Compared to you and me in human form, Satan, or Lucifer, is a boundless supernatural being, which can take all manner of shapes and forms, and can very easily be mistaken for, say, the Holy Spirit - I was told that in 1995 by Archangel Michael, who has had some dealings with Lucifer over a very very long time here and there.
L
How are you sure that wasn't lucifer and not Michael in 1995?
Me
Why would Lucifer blow its cover in that way? In fact, when I was told that, it was just what I needed to hear at that time, but I didn't understand where it applied in my life and I blew a really important assignment that adversely affected me for many years. In fact, I was only thinking about that this afternoon.
L
Lucifer is supposed to be the most beautiful angel of all. Probably the most kindest and alluring to humans.
Me
Lucifer was the most beautiful angel long before humans existed. Based on your and on some of the other comments under this post, and comments under other of my posts about Evil, the Devil, etc., I think this forum is deeply infiltrated by Lucifer, and you and perhaps other members of this forum think that is beautiful? The angels on my case, Jesus, Michael, Melchizedek and Rosa Mystica, cut me very little slack; they do not pamper me (my ego); they apply tough love unceasing; they make me face every aspect of myself; for decades, they have done that, and advised and led and dragged and shoved and yanked me forward, and when I have messed up, which happened many times, they pulled me out of it, usually slowly and it was not easy or fun, and the discipline continued.
L
I don't support Satan. Nice assumption. Just merely asking questions. Questions are answers.
Me
"Lucifer is supposed to be the most beautiful angel of all. Probably the most kindest and alluring to humans."
Wasn't a question.
L
Question phrased as statement. Semantics are irrelevant.
Me
then use ?, to avoid appearing to be a shape shifter.
L
You have many false ideas of Angels and demons. Demons don't always pamper either. All those things you listed, Demons can do them too.
Me
Cut off from God and that energy, Lucifer, other fallen angels, demons are left to feed on people on this world and elsewhere. So Demons do whatever they can to control a person to their agenda and benefit. Angels aligned with God live on that energy, do not need people on this planet or elsewhere to exist. I don't see Lucifer and its legions standing people in front of endless mirrors and telling them to do something about that (the beams in our own eyes), and in that Jesus way move closer to God.
LThat's a little too detailed. Source for all of this? That isn't anecdotal.
Me
Correct, it's not anecdotal, it's the difference between God and angels allegiant to God, and Lucifer and angels allegiant to Lucifer. The former give freely, the latter are takers.
L
Where are you getting this highly detailed info from? The Bible? I'm curious.
Me
Jesus, Michael, Melchizedek, Rosa Mystica, and from direct experience with all of those realms and common sense.
L
Interesting. I learned something today. Thank you.
Me
De nada, vaya con Dios
K
I haven't seen any devils around. I haven't seen any spiritual evolution.
Me
Heh, perhaps you should be happy that you haven't seen any devils? But not that you haven't seen spiritual evolution? In the main, it does seem humanity is retreating from what I was raised to call, God. I suppose that pleases the Devil, but God is ever patient and there are many realms and dimensions where souls can grow or not. Yet, why not grow in this dimension? Well, I suppose the Devil and God both could speak to that?
P
Would humanity know to evolve without Lucifer? Would humanity uphold sacred without Lucifer? Fear breaks the ouroboros and love heals it. There is Divine play going on always. I shall like wondering about this and the possibilities. Thank you.
Me
I enjoy conversing with you.
P
I'm humbled, thank you. I also enjoy speaking with you. Appreciated.
S
Light is most apparent, when it casts a shadow. One without the other, could be said to be nothing at all. It is through the contrast of choice in which we spiritually evolve. It is through the consequence of choice that we learn why light must cast its shadows.
Me
Agreed. This poem fell out of me in late 2003, during a dark night of the soul.
Black is white
White is black
When they fuse
Rainbows bloom
I have no clue how that plays out in the Big Scheme.
I am still very much in human form, dealing with all that entails and with other realms at the same time. From where I sit, it looks to me that the Devil is mostly pleased with humanity's progress, so far. At the rate humanity is killing the planet, humanity will cease to exist relatively soon, except for the elite who get to jump on star ships built by the likes of Elon Musk and Bill Gates, to take humanity somewhere else and pollute it? Perhaps angels, ETs, or ultraterrstrials won't allow that to happen?
A
“The devils greatest trick is convincing the world he didn’t exist” isn’t the truth, it’s a fucking quote from The Usual Suspects. If the devil, who you think you need to believe exists, had any trick, it would be to convince people that God does not exist. Belief in God would be paramount; belief in the devil irrelevant.
Frankly, believing that the devil exists is just giving your attention, thought, feelings, time, faith to the devil. Worshiping him, in other words. And here you are saying humans can only evolve spiritually by the existence of “Lucifer,” a name which non canonical Christianity made up along with all the other myths that show Christianity’s real focus: hell, damnation, devils and demons, eternal suffering, etc. very popular stuff. You can’t see past it. Everything you see is filtered through a lens and you don’t know there’s a lens.
Me
Unfortunately, I have seen Lucifer up close and personal, and demons, and I deal with them all the time, but I won't change your mind to accept the devil's greatest trick indeed is convincing it never existed. In time, though, you will learn otherwise.
S
All things, including Enlightenment have their opposite counterpart. The opposite of Enlightenment is what the Tao Te Ching refers to as an Opaqueness, which Lao Tzu insinuates is the origin of “evil”.
You see this in individuals. As the world beats them down, they fall into an alternate state of being, closed off from the objective reality (Truth). In their opaqueness, they craft deviant intentions, bent thoughts, and other perversions rooted in falsity. This is the basis of evil.
If you trace back many addicts’ and serial killers’ lives, their deviance began with a fundamental lie, which spiraled into a web of chaos and destruction. This passes into the world and begets further evil. Thus, evil can be traced back both through the generations, but also within each person’s own life.
We’ve all succumbed to evil to some degree. A malicious person generates more of it consciously. A lightworker realizes that before he can do any good outwardly, he must first rid himself of his own evil.
Christians believe that is impossible. Thus, emerged the doctrine of substitutionary grace.
Whether you believe in Jesus or not, I’d love to know of an alternative way to truly rid oneself of evil.
Me
Well said.
sloanbashinsky@yahoo.com
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